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Aaron Zavala's avatar

Yes to this all! Thank you for the thoughtful and well-rounded response.

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Griffin Gooch's avatar

Absolutely love the article, Ian 🙌

Totally on board with your analysis. Thanks so much for taking the time to draft a response to that article!

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Young Woong Yi's avatar

Brilliant read, Ian. Thank you for taking the time to articulate these points and thoughts so clearly and charitably.

As someone who has had much of my early theological and spiritual formation from the "Gospel-centered movement", it's been a bit sad and tough to see this type of critique of the neo-spiritual formation movement in the West. The "vibe" I am getting with all of this critique is akin to when Sinclair Ferguson said (and this is a paraphrase), "It's not that people who are legalistic don't understand grace, it's that they don't have a proper understanding of works."

Could it be that people in the "Gospel-centered movement" (as brilliant as many of them are) missed a key part of the Gospel itself? A spiritual life that moves in an outward trajectory? Or as you wrote, "Command, then heart, then hands. Or we could put it this way: What, then why, then how."

What do you think?

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Ian Harber's avatar

It's hard to say. For one reason or another, modern evangelicalism and much of the reformed world ended up believing that transformation comes primarily through head knowledge instead of integrating knowledge into a more wholistic view of a human being that involves the will, soul, body, and social location. I'm sure a lot of it has to do with individualism and an over-emphasis (though not a *wrong* emphasis) on Jesus being our personal savior. Not all, but a good deal of this gets sorted out with a good ecclesiology that is typically much bigger than the normal evangelical view of the church.

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Tim Suffield's avatar

This is great, I'm so glad you responded to that piece; it had pointed to a potential danger but in a way that lost the proverbial baby with the bathwater, and you're the perfect writer to respond. Discipleship is mind-body-heart.

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Ian Harber's avatar

I agree. It got to the worst impulses and implementations of spiritual formation... but no one serious is actually advocating anything that he said.

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Tim Suffield's avatar

One day we'll disagree about something!

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Ian Harber's avatar

I look forward to it!

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Colin Sauskojus's avatar

Great piece, Ian! That whole "mind-body" connection thing is important. Excellent and gracious response.

I think your point on the community aspect of a Rule is underrated (in a broad sense, not by you). As Dean in your comments pointed out, nearly every (if not all) contemplative writers dealing with a Rule describe it in the context of a community. The intent of community is to remind us who we are...or who we are becoming...this happens through formation, which happens through practice.

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Ian Harber's avatar

Thanks Colin. I fi could rewrite and emphasize something more, I'd absolutely emphasize the communal/ecclesial aspect of it. I wrote it in a bit of a hurry, but that's a crucial aspect of all of this.

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Colin Sauskojus's avatar

For sure! I don't think the highlights you made in your piece are at all diminished by a different focus. :-)

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Haley Baumeister's avatar

Excellent piece aside... I love that Ezra is having a moment these days. (Our firstborn's name, as well.)

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Haley Baumeister's avatar

"Truth alone cannot lift our minds and wills to the heights of godliness; we need habit to do that. It is habit that weighs us down and it is our habits that we submit to the Spirit of God and ask to lift with his grace. We follow God not simply in our brains but in our conscious and unconscious habitual actions."

---> This is perhaps the crux of the issue from my experience. In very Scripture-centric expressions of corporate worship, and in denominations that reject much in the way of tradition, communal practices and physical liturgies (which by nature include out bodies and senses), we were left with..... just our brains. A lot of this was seen as a way to avoid "legalism" but many of us ended up spiritually formless, because anything besides "the gospel" was seen as unnecessary striving. But how then are we to worship? How then are we to train ourselves for righteousness? Do we just believe the right things and hope for the best? And yet, we were created as body/mind/soul beings.

Thanks for the thoughtful structure of this piece.

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Ian Harber's avatar

100%. I don't want to de-center scripture, but there has to be some answer to the question "how do I get the things I believe from scripture into my actual life?" Spiritual formation helps provide time-tested answers to that question.

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Ian Harber's avatar

Such a great name! Had no idea it was having a moment when we picked it. Honestly just liked it. But yes! Right there with you.

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Haley Baumeister's avatar

Funny enough, a couple years ago I ran into a substack mutual at a church in a nearby city…. Her firstborn was Ezra as well. Haha

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Ian Harber's avatar

A new family from our church just moved to the street behind us. Their oldest is a few years older than ours... and his name is Ezra. I also know of a family who just had their first a few months back and named him... Ezra. It's a thing!

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Colin Sauskojus's avatar

I hate to join the club, but....! ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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Ian Harber's avatar

Ezra kids, unite!

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Jonathon M. Seidl's avatar

Spot on, once again. Thanks, Ian. Coonce's thoughts on the phone were especially worrisome to me, and I think really hurt his credibility. Anyone who struggles with connectedness who has unplugged from the digital world for any period of time can attest to the NUMEROUS benefits, including the spiritual ones.

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